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Driving Profile: Kate Jetmore
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KATE: When I think of this story. It makes me just break out into a sweat. It’s the kind of thing that you wouldn’t you wouldn’t wish on your worst enemy and you just hope and pray that it will never happen to you again.
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BHAVNEET: Welcome back to Drive With Us, a podcast where we bring on a new guest each episode to talk about the crazy things they’ve experienced on the road, who they are as drivers, and how they became the driver they are today. I’m Bhavneet.
TARANJIT: And I’m Taranjit. And today’s driver is Kate Jetmore. She was raised in Indiana and lived in New York for 12 years before she went to Spain to hike the Camino de Santiago where she met her future husband. And now she is a translator and a voice-over artist and also hosts The Listen podcast. Today she shared with us her experiences of driving in the U.S. versus driving in Spain and a traumatizing experience she had was driving a manual uphill in Spain.
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BHAVNEET: Before we get started, we just want to note that we are testing out new remote recording platforms and because of that the audio quality for our first couple of episodes may vary slightly. So we appreciate your patience as we are learning and figuring everything out. And now to the show.
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BHAVNEET: Welcome Kate to Drive with us Podcast. Thanks so much for joining us today.
KATE: Thanks for having me! It’s a joy to be on.
TARANJIT: I’m so glad you’re excited to be here. We love starting off the show with is your crazy or most memorable experiences. What is one crazy or interesting experience you had while on the road?
KATE: Oh my gosh. Well, I have to say when I think of this story. It makes me just break out into a sweat. Like it’s the kind of thing that you wouldn’t you would not wish on your worst enemy and you just hope and pray that it will never happen to you again. So I live in Spain as you know, and in, I would say in Europe, but definitely in Spain, almost everyone drives a stick. So when I moved here, my boyfriend who is now my husband, had a car that became our car and it was a it was manuel. It was a stick shift. And I I actually learned to drive on a stick shift. So luckily I wasn’t starting from scratch. I knew how to drive the car, but I grew up in Indiana which is, you know, corn country. Flat. Flat. Flat. And I never had to deal with a hill in Indiana which actually changes everything when you’re driving a stick. So I live in a part of Spain. I live in in Cuenca, which is is is definitely not the Mountains but it’s kind of a gateway to the mountains and there are some serious hills here. Some seriously, steep hills. So my first several years I didn’t even drive the car. I rode in the car. But every time I needed to go somewhere around town and this is also quite European, I would ride a bike or just walk. And I suppose somewhere in the back of my mind, I was trying to avoid driving this car. Driving a stick shift on these hills. I do think it was sort of in the back of my mind. But one day I couldn’t avoid it. I had to go somewhere and it involved going up this extremely steep hill. And I I don’t know what gear I was in when I started going up this hill but probably third or second gear, but definitely not first gear which I now know is the gear I should have been in. It’s this it’s actually not a street. It’s almost like a driveway that goes up the steep steep steep hill to get to this really nice hotel. Which now that I think about it it’s the hotel where I had my Wedding Banquet years after that. So I’m driving up the hill and everything is going fine until you know, you know that the car starts to go, Oh, I can’t do it in this gear. You’re going to have to help me out. And I had, you know, I just had so little experience with something like this that I didn’t really even know how to downshift which is what I needed to do and I don’t remember the details. It was so traumatic that I think I probably blocked a lot of it out. But let’s say I started in 3rd gear. Maybe I managed to shift shift down to 2nd gear. But in any case you’ve already imagined what happened, which is that I get half way up this hill or a third of the way up this hill. Not only was it very steep but it was very long. I mean, it’s it’s quite a ways up this hill and I get only part of the way up the hill and the car stalls and stops. So I’m sitting there in a car that is not running. It is stopped in the middle of this hill. I’m in the middle of nowhere. I’m in the car alone. And I thought, Okay, I can do this. I can do this. But I was panicking.I was I mean I knew I kept telling myself I can do this, but I just knew that I couldn’t. So I, you know, I put my one foot on the, oh. I’m so nervous telling this story that I can’t even think of the words. I put one one foot on the clutch and one foot on the brake and I start the car.So I’m like, Okay. Good. It’s running. I managed to start it again. And then I just had no idea how to get this thing going up this hill because I knew that as soon as I took my foot off the brake it would roll backwards. I now know that you use the parking brake to make sure you know, you it’s sort of a game between the clutch foot and a hand on the brake which I still am not able to deal with even many many years later. But that day I was just complete virgin with the handbrake and the whole concept. So I tried to do it with just my feet. Just the clutch and the brake as if I were on flat land as if I were in Indiana a parking lot in Indiana. Which was not a strategy that I should have taken because as you can imagine I start rolling backwards. Thank God there wasn’t a car right behind me and so I just slammed on the brakes and I thought how am I going to do this? How am I going to do this? I’m stuck. And so what I did was I put the parking brake on. I turned the car off and I called my friend who lived in the old town. So the old town in Cuenca where I live like most old European cities is up high. It’s in a very strategic place where the cathedral is in the old castle ruins. They’re all up high where they could defend themselves back in the day. And she lived up in that neighborhood. So I knew that it probably wasn’t the most convenient thing for her to do but I knew that she was fairly close and I knew that she would know how to handle this because she’s a Spanish woman. She learned how to drive a stick here. She lives in the city. So, you know, she deals and she also lived in the old town. So by definition every day, she had to drive up and down hills to get to her house. Not the same hill, but different hills. And and I thought that you know, she’s only a five-minute walk away. She can walk across the bridge and hop my car and get me out of this. And that’s what she did. Talk about a friend. She got there and I was just you can’t ask for that kind of help from just anyone. And thats the kind of thing that makes your friendship even tighter. I I, you know, was just like almost in a fetal position. I was so embarrassed and so like traumatized. And so I just hopped in the in the shotgun seat and she hopped in the driver seat. And she just drove me up to the top of the hill and turned the car around. And then I was able to drive down. Downhill is not an issue.
BHAVNEET: I bet.
KATE: Oh my gosh. So thank you so much. This feels like therapy. And thank you for guiding me through that and whew. I think I’m kind of on the other side of it now, so thank you.
TARANJIT: Was this when you were fairly new to Spain?
KATE: Yeah. Well I lived here for five years before I got married and I wasnt married yet. So less than 5 years, probably more than a year. Because as I said, you know the first little bit of living here, I didn’t drive at all. And I also I think that traumatic experience followed on the hill on the heels of the first time I drove the car here, which was also traumatic. So my boyfriend had to have surgery and it wasn’t major surgery, but he was going to be he had a hernia and so when he was released from the hospital he was good to go as far as coming home and not being in the hospital, but he was going to be off work. He needed to be in bed. He was not allowed to lift anything. That was he wasn’t allowed to drive because you know, it’s a pretty physical endeavor driving a stick shift. So I as an adult…I had to say that because I felt like I was like 7. I mean I just felt so like somebody save me, you know. So it fell to me to drive him home. And I thought I could you know, I don’t know why I didn’t like practice or something beforehand, but I knew how to drive a stick. It wasn’t, you know, I I knew how to get the car from point A to point B, but again, I hadn’t taken into consideration that I live in this city that with these narrow little streets and roundabouts and kind of parking lots that have lots of like gravel and they were just things that I had never dealt with in a stick shift so I drove him home from the hospital, but it was not pretty. It was really not pretty. Like literally the only thing that I did was get him home without him walking but it was not a smooth ride shall we say. And so the the story where my friend Amu had to come and rescue me on my on that hill was after that first story. So those were lets say after maybe two years of living here or something like that.
TARANJIT: Well it sounds like these two stick shift experiences haven’t deterred you from continuing to drive.
KATE: You haven’t, I actually love driving a stick shift. My only fear with a stick shift is the whole uphill thing and I think it’s because of the story I just told you. I think if before that happened if someone had actually said, okay now here’s a critical thing that you’re going to need. Here’s a here’s a skill that you may need. So, you know like parallel parking or fill in the blank. But no one ever did that because it wasn’t an issue. I mean when I when I got my driver’s license in Indiana where I’m from all the cars in drivers ed were automatic. I did learn to drive a stick shift because my first car was a stick shift, but that was completely but that was just kind of a wild card. Like it just happened that this car that became available was a stick shift, and so my mom taught me to drive a stick shift. But I feel like if someone had actually at some point said let’s do this thing where you learn how to manage the hand emergency brake the handbrake and an uphill. It’s a little tricky but you can do it. I think if I had had that moment and not had that traumatic experience on the hill that it would be a very different story nowadays. But I do drive a stick shift and both of our cars are stick shifts and it’s not really an issue.
TARANJIT: A lot of people here in U.S., I know for sure don’t drive an automatic. And the past guess we’ve talked to always opted for an automatic. But in your situation, it’s great that you learned stick shift first because you ended up in Spain where more cars are manual than automatic.
KATE: Yeah, it’s very very unusual to come into contact with an automatic in Spain at least in my experience. And generally and this is you know, it’s it’s so like it’s kind of unusual it’s more usual in the states to drive an automatic. But you do come in contact with stick shifts, right? And it’s just like a car that happens to not be automatic and you either do or don’t know how to drive that kind of transmission. Whereas in Spain almost all the cars are manual and if you come into contact with an automatic, it’s a very it it’s it’s kind of a class thing. Like a person who has an automatic car kind of by definition is going to have like a really really good job. They’re wealthy or like it’s a it’s a status symbol having an automatic car here.
TARANJIT: Yeah. I feel like the only country we can compare to that we went to outside of the U.S. is India. And the situation is similar there where automatic is kind of associated with you have more money. So you can afford this more…
BHAVNEET: Elite.
TARANJIT: …fancier car.
KATE: Yes. Yes. It is the exact same thing. Yeah.
TARANJIT: I know you mentioned that the roads are narrower there. Are there typically smaller cars there and how was your experience of driving through narrow roads?
KATE: Well I would say yes, the cars in general are all much smaller. And part of that is based on you know, I don’t really notice cars that much. My husband worked in a store that was associated with Nissan for many many years. He doesn’t work there anymore. But he as part of that those many years were that he worked there, he really notices cars. And he notices not just the color. For me. It’s like a red car. A blue car. For him. It’s like the make, the model, the year, the license plate, any kind of dings on the car. And so when we go to the United States, he always comments on the cars. He’s always talking about. Oh, that’s a such-and-such model, but here it’s really big. Like it’s way way bigger, you know.
TARANJIT: Yeah.
KATE: The American style of Mercedes or Honda or whatever. So yes, the cars are smaller. We happen to have a car that’s considered to be pretty big by Spanish standards. It’s kind of like it it’s a Nissan, but in the states, I’ve seen a car that looks looks a lot like it which is like a Hyundai. Like a you know with 5 seats and a really big trunk. I can’t remember the name of the car. But anyways. People I think people do have smaller cars because there are so many narrow kind of Village Old Town streets, but also because of fuel efficiency. And you know in the United States when we talk about fuel efficiency, when you see that in the news I I feel like I always get the feeling that people are using that term because they are, you know, sort of aware and they’re thinking about the environment and they’re thinking about their children’s future. And I I don’t mean to say that all Americans are only thinking those things and I don’t mean to say that all Spaniards are not thinking those things. But I can tell you that here fuel efficiency is all about how much it costs to put gas in your car. Yeah so people want a smaller car so that I mean, I think this is just my my sense, but they they want a car that’s more fuel efficient so that it’s not expensive to be driving your car.
TARANJIT: That makes sense. When you were mentioning your husband in the U.S, and like always noticing all the things about cars. I feel like that’s just a guy thing. I feel like guys tend to.cuz our brother is the same way. Like he was just here a car like not even look out the window and he’ll be like, oh yeah. That’s this this and this. And I’m like, you didn’t even look at it.
KATE: Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I don’t know if it’s a guy thing or not, but I’ll tell you what, it is. definitely not a me thing. Like I I I don’t know how people do it or even why they’re interested. I just can’t imagine. To each his own.
BHAVNEET: I mean I think I might be a little weird like that. It’s like I don’t know when I see cars, I just notice like, oh look that’s a Toyota. Or that’s a Nissan. I don’t really like that’s a car. That’s a truck.
KATE: Right. Right. Yeah.
BHAVNEET: So there’s typically stereotypes that are associated with drivers of different areas. And since you have driven in both Spain and in the U.S., have you noticed any stereotypes of drivers in the areas that you lived?
KATE: Yes. I mean, there’s kind of the thes stereotype that I think you find in most countries, which is and it just makes me so sad to be saying this in the year 2020, but, you know, women drivers but especially old women drivers like if there is kind of an elderly woman driving a car people expect her to be a bad driver or if you’re if you can see a car kind of driving super super slow or swerving out of the lane, people just assume that it’s going to be either a woman or or elderly woman. And you know as with all generalizations, sometimes that’s the case. My personal experience has led me to a a gosh I don’t even know how to say this but I was going to say it’s led me to sort of develop my own stereotype. I don’t know if that’s how I should say it. But here’s what I’ve observed that young men in Spain young men drivers are nuts. They are so like it is so crazy. They’re so reckless and not all of them of course, but there’s this thing that is very very common very prevalent and it used to sneak up on me. And it used to be very very very upsetting to me. And it used to lead to me laying on the horn and then feeling kind of rattled for the rest of the day. And I’m going to tell you what it is, but first, let me tell you but first let me tell you that it happened so frequently that one day I thought, Kate, you have got to relax about this because it’s going to happen. It’s going to happen. It happened today. It happened yesterday. And it’s going to happen tomorrow. Here’s the thing that happened. Whereas in in the United States definitely in Indiana where I grew up there are lots of four way stops. Whether that be a stoplight or stop sign. In Spain, there are stop lights, but there are never stop signs. Almost never stop signs. And in the replacement for that in Spain is a roundabout. So in the bigger cities a roundabout can have 6 lanes. 8 lanes. I don’t live in a big city. My city is like 40,000 people. So roundabouts have two lanes. You got your outside lane and your inside lane. And the traffic laws say that when you enter the roundabout you enter in the outside lane. I mean by definition, right? That’s the first line that you merge into. Nobody really breaks that law because it’s physically impossible. But when you leave the roundabout when you exit the roundabout, you must exit the roundabout from the outside lane. But if you think about it, if you try to go in a straight line. it’s a lot faster to just go in as straight a line as possible from the time you enter the roundabout to the time you leave the roundabout. Which means that you like you go in immediately into the inside lane and then you exit from the inside lane. And what happens is people who kind of do the whole roundabout in the outside lane like me. I’m raising my hand. Like here I am putt putt putting around the outside lane. Because that’s a lot slower, right. And here comes this hot rod on my left and he just goes zoop and cuts right in front of me to get out of the roundabout before I can. Which is completely illegal, but I cannot tell you how common it is. It happens all the time. And so now because it was making me so upset like on the daily that I made a conscious decision to relax. I have become a super defensive driver and every time I go into a roundabout, I just expect that that might happen. And it almost always does.
BHAVNEET: That’s really crazy. Like I we don’t have that big of roundabouts here. They’re starting to become more popular around our area, but I can only imagine having that many lanes in a roundabout. I don’t even know where to where I would begin. I would be like you just in the edge like
KATE: Right.
BHAVNEET: I’ll make it there eventually.
KATE: Right. Right. Well, as I said, I mean our little small-town roundabouts only have two lanes. But when I go to like to Madrid for work or when I travel to Barcelona before and there are these huge roundabouts. Huge. I mean, I don’t even know how many lanes they have. 5. 6. 7. 8 lanes in the roundabout. And it’s just crazy. The traffic is crazy. It’s just like every man for himself. And so I feel kind of bashful even complaining about this, you know this little thing that happens in my town, cuz it’s really not a big deal compared to what you see in these big cities and these huge roundabouts. But I think part of the reason it’s that it’s so upsetting is because it’s so so common. And it’s right there in the traffic laws that that’s not how you do it. You know, it’s like a stop sign. You come to a you come to a stop at the stop sign. You look both ways. And then when it’s your turn, you go. And of course not everyone does it that way but you don’t you don’t see people like whizzing through stop signs every day. You might see it once in a while, but it’s not something you see regularly.
TARANJIT: Yeah. That would give me a lot of anxiety. I don’t know if I would be able to drive through those big circles the way you’re describing it.
KATE: Yeah.
TARANJIT: Do the police not enforce these rules there? Or is that something the police doesn’t look out for?
KATE: I have never seen anyone get a ticket. I’ve seen people get parking tickets, but I’ve never seen anyone. I guess. I seen people get pulled over on the highway. But again that doesn’t for speeding ticket that doesn’t happen that often either. It’s very strange. The whole traffic cop thing is very strange. You see people break the law that you and and people know that is happening. I mean, everyone has these stories. it’s no secret. But for some reason the cops are just not interested in enforcing the law. I’m not really sure why. You would think you know kind of source of income for the city, you know to be ticketing people for this kind of thing. But.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. If it’s that common.
KATE: Yeah. And there’s kind of this sense that the police don’t want to be seen as being unpopular. Like they they don’t want to be doing something that’s unpopular. Which is completely a mystery to me. I mean the police are there to enforce the law, so I don’t know. I have no answers for you.
TARANJIT: So I know you’re mentioning that one of the differences you noticed is the whole stop sign and roundabouts in the U.S. versus Spain. Are there any other unique or different laws that you’ve noticed between the two countries?
KATE: I can’t really think of any when it comes to traffic or driving. I mean, the signage is a little bit different. Kind of the style of how what signs look like and obviously everything is in kilometers. The on-ramps and off ramps for highways are shorter. So like if you think of I think you guys are near DC, is that right?
TARANJIT: Yeah. We’re in Maryland.
KATE: Okay. So like all that infrastructure with big highways around DC or Baltimore, New York, LA. There you’ve got those huge looping round exit and entrance ramps. Which are it’s a it’s a tight angle when you’re when you’re going around those curves. But it’s actually they’ve they’ve calibrated those curves so that it’s as comfortable as possible at as high a speed as possible to keep traffic flowing right?
Well in Europe, there simply is not enough space. I mean, this is a country that was developed and settled long long long before cars. And so the way entrance ramps and entrance ramps work you have to slow way way down because there just isn’t enough room to have that huge swooping ark that you can keep on going at a high speed around to get on or off the highway. So that’s a big one that I’ve noticed.
TARANJIT: So are the speeds slower in Spain in comparison to the U.S.?
KATE: They’re not but you do have to slow way down for the to get on and off the highway. The speed limit on the highway is like a 120 km an hour or so that’s around 80. So I guess it’s a little faster than the States
BHAVNEET: Yeah. Way faster.
KATE: Yeah and of course no one goes that slow in quotes. You know there are always people who are just like a bullet going past you on the highway.
TARANJIT: Yeah. Exactly.
BHAVNEET: So that here is considered reckless driving and you get extra fined for doing that.
KATE: Yeah. And the people who are doing that it’s funny because when I said it’s the young men. It’s the 20-year olds. It’s the 25-year-olds. Those are the guys those are the people that are a problem in a roundabout. But the people who are shooting passed you at the speed of light on the highway are older men. Those are those are the men who can afford to buy that status symbol automatic car. Those are the guys who are sailing down the highway So that’s kind of a different profile.
TARANJIT: I guess I mean. I’m trying to think of if that’s like what we see here, but I feel like here it’s the younger guys who like have those sporty cars and just want to show off.
BHAVNEET: But no since everyone has pretty much automatics, it’s like anyone and everyone is speeding everywhere.
KATE: Yeah. Yeah, I can see that.
TARANJIT: So now that we have crazier stories. Let’s dive into what kind of driver you are. So are you the type of person who when given the option would rather drive or be a passenger?
KATE: You know it really depends on who the driver is. I there are people I can think of people in my life who shall remain nameless who I would prefer not to be in the passenger seat while they’re driving. But the the best driver and I’m not just saying that’s the best driver I have ever had the privilege of riding with in a car is my husband. He is and it may be because he worked for all those years for Nissan. I’m not really sure. But he’s super super he’s just aware and he’s safe. But without the he’s not afraid, you know, he’s not he’s not like white-knuckling. He’s very relaxed and very present. And he knows what he’s very comfortable and he’s you know, he puts it in cruise control like right exactly on the speed limit and when we get there we get there. And he’s not a honker. So if Rodrigo is the driver then you know, sign me up. But then there are also other circumstances where I love being the driver. So I grew up in rural Indiana and I love the feeling of just driving a familiar back country road that I you know I’ve driven down countless times my entire life. And I know those stretches of road in every, you know at every time of day at every time of the year. And I have memories just peppered along these these old lanes and country roads. So if those are the circumstances, I like being the driver. I like I mean, I love being the driver. Especially if I’m alone with with the radio on, not in a hurry, no one is waiting for me at home. I think I could just do that like all day long.
TARANJIT: I am the same way like that since we live out in the open in comparison to the near the city and hear Maryland. I really enjoy the open roads and like they just go for long stretches and not have to worry about the constant stopping in like all the crazy city drivers.
KATE: Right. You know, I’ve talked about Indiana and I’ve talked about Spain,but I also lived in New York. I went to NYU for college and I lived in New York for over 12 years. And so there’s this theres this big chunk of my life when I didn’t drive at all. I mean, I never drove. I took the subway. I walked. I took cabs. And so I feel like the kind of holes in my driving, you know, the the the parts of my driving that maybe could be improved upon are more a result of lack of hours behind the wheel. And like like like my husband is super super skilled at parking a car in a super tight spot for example. And that’s because he grew up in this town and it’s all these hills and these tiny little, you know, narrow hairpin turns and little tiny lanes and streets in the old town. And so he’s got a lot of practice. It’s like for him that is driving. And for me when I think of driving like what feels normal like what what does it mean to be a driver. For me, I really associate that with Indiana and wide open spaces. And you don’t have to I mean, even if you’re in this city like you think about the Walmart parking lot, you don’t have to you don’t have to be a skilled driver to park in the Walmart parking lot because the the spaces are ginormous.
TARANJIT: Yes.
KATE: They’re huge. And that’s mainly because the cars are ginormous, but and the people are ginormous. But you know, I I do I do feel most comfortable in that in the setting in the driving setting that I grew up in and sort of where I cut my teeth. And I have here, you know here in Spain mainly because my my son was born almost 13 years ago now and you know, once you become a mom like you can’t, you know you if you have to get your baby to the pediatrician on the other side of town you kind of need a car and a car seat. Whereas, if it was just me. I was just you know, it’s a half hour walk, I would walk it. But that really changed my life when my son was born. I really I really had to I really became more of a driver here in Spain. And now that he’s older I try to incorporate more walking and biking. But it does change things when you got like places to be in stuff and to take. So yeah, I sort of feel like I got off track. But anyway, we’re still talking about driving.
TARANJIT: Yeah. Depending on the circumstances, just having a car sometimes just makes everything so much easier, especially when you had your kid. It just made life easier for you to be able to go there yourself in a car.
KATE: Yeah. For sure.
TARANJIT: So when you were in New York and you didn’t get the opportunity to drive, did you miss driving or were you okay with having to take public transportation?
KATE: You know, I don’t even think I thought about it. I was I was 18 and I was off to the big city to study theater and be way far away from my family and I think that buses and taxis and the subway were part and parcel with that experience. And I don’t so I don’t think that I even thought about it. I don’t I don’t like I guess the answer to your question is that I didn’t miss it because I was so focused on what it means to live in New York and and driving at least at that point in my life was not part of what I saw as the New York experience. So, no, I didn’t really miss that.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. I feel like that is the case for lots of people in New York, its like you don’t really even need a car cuz they’re so many other ways to get around.
KATE: And not only do you not need a car. But if you have a car it’s a huge inconvenience. I mean, I guess it depends on what your needs are. Like if you need to be getting to New Jersey everyday, then there are there’s definitely an upside an upside to having a car and but if you don’t really need a car and you have a car in New York, basically what you’re doing is just like figuring out where to park it and pay for it and not get it not have it be broken into you know.
TARANJIT: Yeah. And I also feel like the drivers there would give me anxiety because they drive really crazy and they don’t really care about the other drivers around them. They just want to get to where they need to be.
KATE: Right.
BHAVNEET: Now that you are back to driving, how would you describe the kind of driver that you are and would you say that like your friends and family would describe your driving the same way?
KATE: This is a tough question because it requires being sort of objective about my own driving and I don’t know if that’s possible. So that said I do think I’m a pretty good driver. Is that enough of an answer? I do think I’m a pretty good driver. But it’s it’s I feel like I do best when there’s no one sort of like witnessing me driving. I do better. You know, I’ve said all these glowing things about my husband and he is the best but I have to say when I’m in the driver’s seat and my husband’s in the passenger seat, which doesn’t happen very often. it’s mainly like if we’ve gone out of town for a meal and he had something to drink then I’m the one who drives home. The sort of thing. And I don’t think that he is judging me but there’s this little voice in my head that that feels like is he judging me. Like what if he is judging me? What is it that he is thinking? And then, you know, that whole sort of imaginary conversation unfolds in my head and makes me angry. Which is awful. But I a house that we lived in a few years ago, the access to the garage was really really really tricky. As you can gather from what I’m telling you about where I live like the access to most places and cars is tricky. And that was the case with our garage. So there was like a ramp the garage was sort of like under the house. So it was down this pretty steep ramp. And it was steep, but it was all so narrow. And so I didn’t want to ever have to back out of the garage. So I always backed into the garage so that when it was time to get out of the garage I can just push the gas and go up the steep ramp and get out. It wasn’t quite as steep as that hill from my horrible story. And so actually when this happened, my husband was out of town, but my son was in the car. He was really little. He was just like 5 or something. So we had not been living in that house very long and I started to back down the ramp and the car it wasn’t going straight and I wasn’t able to sort of straighten it out and not because the the ramp was so it was just so narrow. And anyway, long story short, I scraped up a back bumper on the drivers side. And so now the access to my current garage is it’s kind of tricky but not as tricky as that garage. And I do pretty well. Like I’ve never scraped up my car backing into this garage. And when I’m alone and I feel like no ones watching me or I don’t know if anyones watching me. I do fine and I’m relaxed with parking in my garage. But the times that either my husband is in the passenger seat or like I pull up and he just happens to also be arriving on his bike. So he’s like waiting for me to park before he comes into the garage. I get so flustered. I get I get like, what is he does he does he think I’m doing a good job. Or does is am I going to hit the car and then he’s going to see that and think that that’s how I drive when that’s not how I drive. So I guess the show answer is that I think I’m a pretty good driver, but I can kind of psych myself out from time to time.
BHAVNEET: Would you say that you tend to drive differently if someone’s in the car with you versus if you’re driving alone?
KATE: I do think so, and I don’t think I really considered that before but I mean based on what I just tell told you. I do think that’s an issue. I think that that I that I spend probably spend more time than I should wondering what other people are thinking.
TARANJIT: I know you mentioned that you would reverse or back up into the one garage you had, had that made you more comfortable reverse driving? And do you prefer forward or reverse parking?
KATE: I mean, I always prefer going forward cuz I can see better. But if I have to choose between backing into the garage or backing out of the garage, I really prefer backing in. It’s sort of the lesser of two evils. The other thing is that we have a camera on the back of her car and that is such a lifesaver. When my son and I go to the United States to visit my family, I have a car there that I keep there and it does not have a camera and I always miss it. I always miss it so much cuz I’m really not used to just navigating when I’m backing up or parallel parking or whatever with the mirrors. And you know, that’s how I learned. I mean in drivers ed. It was all mirrors and no cameras. But I really at some point have become very dependent on that camera on it.
TARANJIT: Yeah. Once you have the like upgraded technology, going back without it just feels different. You’re just so used to like always looking at you and you’re like now, I don’t have it.
KATE: Yeah. I know. Exactly. And you don’t realize it until it’s gone.
TARANJIT: What would you say is your biggest pet peeve when you’re driving?
KATE: I think it’s that roundabout thing where people cut you off from the inside lane of the roundabout. It is so upsetting. I hope this never happens to you guys. Now that I was mentioned it’s going to happen to you tomorrow and I apologize in advance.
TARANJIT: You jinxed it.
KATE: I know. I know. Yeah, I mean, I I also I guess I don’t I think that is my biggest pet peeve. But I also I really think that driving driving and parking are real indications of good citizenship and I think when people double park or triple park and then they just kind of like it’s kind of like what we all do it, you know. That is that’s a pet peeve to me, too. It’s like why don’t we all do the right thing? Like how about if we all sort of collaborate so that we’re all giving a good example to our children and following the laws and you know, like being good citizens. And I think it in places where it’s sort of like what we’re seeing now with the with the whole coronavirus crisis. You know, you see something like someone double parking or triple parking and it’s annoying but really it’s it’s all most dangerous. Like it’’s it’s indicative of it’s indicative of a very dangerous mindset, which is I can do whatever I want. And we can’t do whatever we want. We’re not living on a desert island. We’re living in a society. And a functioning society requires people to collaborate and comply and abide by the rules. So I guess that’s a pet peeve as well. You know people who knowingly and continually, consistently break the rules.
TARANJIT: People in those situations think like, oh I’ll just do it. But then when it happens to them, they are like, why is this person doing this?
KATE: Right. Because it’s not them.
TARANJIT: Yup.
BHAVNEET: Speaking of annoying drivers, have you ever experienced road rage whether it was you who experienced it or someone who was having road rage around you?
KATE: I have never seen anyone else. I’ve never I’ve never seen I’ve never witnessed an example of that, you know between two other cars or or anything like that. As I said when I was describing the whole roundabout dynamic, I used I mean that really really used to get under my skin and I would just lay on the horn. Like as soon as I saw someone about to do that I mean the horn, what is the horn for? The horn is to like alert someone Be careful. You know, be careful. I don’t think you realize it. But you’re about to pull out in front of me. This this that could be dangerous for both of us. But you know what it feels like when you lay on the horn, that’s not the reason you’re not you’re not like giving a polite tap to say careful. Like to a little kid who’s about to touch a hot stove. Like be careful. You’ll bring your little fingers. No. What when you lay on the horn what you’re communicating to someone is you’re like big making a rude gesture at them. And that felt bad to me. It just felt like it felt like it was making me someone that I don’t want to be and that I hope I’m not. And so I made a really conscious decision to stop doing that. Even when I wanted to and even when it felt like it just felt so sort of I felt so powerless when I would see these moments coming where oh here comes this guy who’s going to wiz right past me and break the law. Just blatantly break the law. Again. Just like the guy who did it yesterday. And and it felt at first it felt like so unsatisfying to leave that moment unrecognized, you know by honking at him. But at a certain point I just thought you know what he doesn’t care that I’m honking at him and I do care that I’m honking at him. I don’t like it. So it’s not having any kind of effect that it’s not making him change his behavior and it’s not making me feel better. So let’s stop doing that.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. You kind of just get to a point where you’re like, okay, I’m going to think about me now. You do whatever craziness you want to do.
KATE: Exactly. Cuz you know at the end of the day you have you go home with yourself. You don’t go home with that jerk from the roundabout. Like you said, like that’s the way you’re going to drive like you’re the one who has to live with you. And I felt like it was affecting my relationship with myself, you know. I didn’t feel good about going home with this angry honky woman. So I feel I feel really good about that decision and I don’t even feel the urge to honk like that anymore.
TARANJIT: Yeah. The most important part is that you get home safe. So whatever you can do to keep yourself safe on the road and stay away from those crazier drivers, that’s the most important part.
KATE: Exactly. Well said.
TARANJIT: Now that we know what kind of driver you are, let’s go back to how it all started. How would you describe your first-time driving experience? And who was it with?
KATE: Gosh. That was a few odd years ago. So I think, you know, there may have been again I’m from a very rural part of the United States. Central Eastern Indiana. Very very rural. And so and I’m also from well my dad’s side of the family is is from an even more rural part of Indiana in Northern Indiana. And so I always mowed the grass you know on a riding a riding mower and I from time to time I would have permission to like drive a little tractor or I mean, this is not a motorized vehicle but we always had like horse carts and I was allowed to hook the horses up to them. And so all of that is driving, you know, it’s navigating and making good decisions as the person who’s like in charge of this vehicle right? But the first time I ever drove a car, I believe I was with my mom. We didn’t end up buying this car, but we were kind of looking around at used cars and there’s this used car that I really really wanted just because it was it was not the right car for me and we didn’t end up getting it. But it was really flashy and I thought it would impress on my friends. But it was a stick and my mom was like well, you’re going to have to learn how to drive manual transmission. And I was like, well are you can you teach me? And my mom was like, yeah. My mom was always really proud of the fact that she could drive a stick. Which I never understood before I was able to drive and I actually even think it took me longer than that to appreciate where she was coming from. And I’d have to ask her, but the the conclusion that I have drew that I’ve drawn over the years is that it gave her a sense of freedom and kind of agency and power as a woman in a generation of women who often didn’t have agency. You know, my my grandmother didn’t have a driver’s license at all until she was well into her adulthood. And so my mom, I think my mom felt like being able to drive both automatic and manual made it so that no matter what situation she was in whatever vehicle was there, she would be able to drive it. So I think with a lot of pride and a big smile on her face, she was able to be the one to teach me how to drive a stick. And I’m laughing because it was not a smooth process. There were a lot of you know just kind of the typical image from a movie. I mean if you think about like some rom-com or something with a mother trying to teach her daughter how to drive a stick with their head sort of snapping back on their necks. That’s that’s what we looked like. And there was some tension like I definitely remember feeling frustrated with her and I can feel her frustration with me although she did a pretty good job of keeping that undercover. And again, I didn’t end up buying that car or my parents didn’t end up buying that car for me. They did buy me a different car and that car was a stick. So yeah, my my first time driving and learning was with my mom and it was in some parking lot near the place that was with that was trying to sell that first car. But then I also took driver’s ed. That was through summer school at my high school and that would have been I think the summer between sophomore and junior year. I turned 16. My birthday is in April. So at that point, I believe the law in Indiana was that you had to be 16 and a month or 16 and a month and day or something a little bit random like that. And I remember like any sixteen-year-old. I was so excited. I mean I had had this day circled in red marker on my calendar for months. I mean maybe even closer to a year. And the day rolled around and my mom drove me down there. I think we might have even gone like before school to the license branch to get my license and they were not able to help me because the computers were down. And I was so upset and bless her heart, my mom drove me to probably like 20 or 30 minutes away to some different branch of the DMV in some town that was you know, not too far from my town and I got my my drivers license there. So I was still able to get it on that on that same day.
TARANJIT: That’s awesome.
KATE: Yeah.
TARANJIT: I mean at least you got a chance to drive manual first. I feel like a lot of people go straight for the automatic and then eventually drive manual But being able to drive a manual just gives you the opportunity to drive whatever car you want to drive.
KATE: Right. I also think that when you learn on a manual, I mean there’s a difference between being an American girl who learn on a manual in the United States
And like kids in Europe who learn on a manual because that’s like the only kind of car that’s around. It’s a very different those are two very different situations. But there’s there’s a huge difference between learning on a manual and then driving an automatic which is like walking in high heels and then walking tennis shoes. Right? Between that and at least in the United States like learning on an automatic and then I might be wrong about this but my feeling like the feeling that I always sort of sensed and I felt like I was aware of and I don’t mean to I don’t mean to overgeneralize. I don’t I don’t think this is necessarily how everyone feels, but this was always what I sort of observed and sensed was that people were like, well, I don’t need to know how to drive a stick because I have an automatic, everyone I know has an automatic, and like like who cares. Who like it is almost like a manual transmission was not even like in their realm of it wasn’t wasn’t in their world. So they just it’s almost like languages.Like people are like well, why would I need to speak how to speak French? I don’t live in French. I don’t live in France or know anyone who needs to speak with me in French. So it’s like this thing in the way way back up your mind. But I mean, it’s I don’t know if a coincidence or just the universe knowing what was coming up for me, but it was definitely a positive when I moved to Spain that I had that trick up my sleeve.And that it was a skill that I could sort of dust off.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. So when you went to go take your driving test in Indiana were you able to get it on the first try?
KATE: I did. Yeah. I mean I was very very well prepared for that test. I had been to and I don’t know if this was the law or not, but I had you know spent the summer taking driver’s ed. I kind of remember it as being. Summer but it may have been like, you know one class that took a month. I don’t really remember. But you know, we were out driving everyday and when we weren’t driving we were in the classroom doing like the theoretical part of the exam, preparing for the written exam, and then we had I don’t know if they even do this anymore, but we had what were they called they were called? What’s the word? They had like these machines that oh simulators. We had to spend time in the simulators. So they were these like very low-tech because this would have been the 80s. The mid-to-late eighties. These machines that sort of simulated being in a car. And so that whole package driving a simulator, driving an actual car, preparing for the written test, it all added up. All of that that was drivers ed. And then oh, yeah. So my birthday is in April, I would have gotten my license in late May. But the summer that I’m describing the the the drivers ed experience that I’m describing would have been a whole year before that. Yeah the summer before that. So in all those intervening months between that summer and the May that I got my driver’s license, I was driving. You know, I would I had my permit. So I was able to, you know drive anytime my mom was in the car, my dad was in the car, my stepmom was in the car, my brother was in the car, and I did. Sso I think by the time that big day rolled around to actually get my license. I was a very very prepared.
TARANJIT: I never heard of drivers ed school having simulators before.
KATE: Really?
TARANJIT: Yeah. I didn’t know that was a thing.
KATE: Yeah. I mean I don’t know if it is anymore. It’s possible that they’re like, why don’t we just get the kids in a car?
TARANJIT: Maybe.
KATE: And the other thing is that they were so not realistic. Like basically what you more than kind of learning how to drive a car you were learning how to beat the simulator.
TARANJIT: So it was kind of like a game.
KATE: Kind of. And they were so I mean honestly like it was almost like some like a video game that you would find in an arcade or like at a theme park where you’re sitting in this kind of tacky fake leather bucket seat and you got the screen in front of you with like other cars and like this pixelated road. And you’ve got your hands at 10 and 2 on the steering wheel. And their likes you got headphones on to your it I mean it is it’s like a video game. It’s totally is like a video game. .
TARANJIT: It sounds like one.
KATE: Yeah. Oh my God that just sounds so it’s like Ferris Buellers Day Off or something
BHAVNEET: Exactly.
KATE: Like some bad, I mean Ferris Bueller’s Day Off is brilliant, but it’s like some 80s movie.
TARANJIT: When you took your driver’s test, was it on a manual car?
KATE: No. No, no. It was automatic. And it’s so funny because my dad lives down in this beautiful valley. He lives down in a river valley. And so the access to his house his lane he had this long lane that goes from the road all the way far away from the road and then goes down into the valley. And so I haven’t thought about this in years, you guys. This is so funny. But my driver’s ed teacher happened to know my dad and happened to I don’t know if they were friends, but he he was familiar with where my dad lived. And so one of the things he said to all of us was if you guys have like any kind of tricky element when it comes to like your house or parking near school or like if there’s any sort of tricky thing that you can foresee in your driving future, let’s do that together on one of the days that were driving together. And so and then he looked at me and he said were going to practice on your dad’s hill. And now I look back at that and then like practice in an automatic. Like what was why would we need to do that? And we did it. We all well not all just me. I took my turn driving down the hill and I turned around and I drove up the hill. But then I think of my hill story in the in the manual here in Cuenca in Spain and how I stalled and stopped and could not get up that hill. And thank God I practiced on my dad’s hill on that automatic in my driver’s ed car. It didn’t really help me when push came to shove.
TARANJIT: Your driver’s ed class sounds like it was actually beneficial. I feel like when I went through driver’s ed, it wasn’t that helpful at all.
KATE: Oh really? Mine definitely was. It definitely was. I mean, I don’t think I really appreciate it at the time. I probably was like typical fifteen-year-old like rolling my eyes about it and stuff. But when I look back at it, I definitely felt prepared. I definitely was well prepared for the test and then for like being a driver.
TARANJIT: Yeah. My instructor that I had he either zoned out while we were taking a test drive and then last minute forgot to tell me I had to make a turn.
KATE: And then did you have to like…
TARANJIT: Slam on the brakes.
KATE: Did he make you …
TARANJIT: Because he was like this is it.
KATE: Were you do you did you live where you live now? Like were you in an urban area when you did all that?
TARANJIT: So yeah. We are out in more country roads.
KATE: Okay. Alright. I’m sort of imagining you like on the beltway.
TARANJIT: No. No. Yeah. He just zoned out and then he was like, oh man. I forgot to tell you, we were supposed to turn there.
KATE: Oh gosh. Oh my gosh. Well I can tell you who that whose fault that was.
TARANJIT: Thank God no car was coming behind me when I had to stop all of a sudden.
KATE: Oh my gosh.
TARANJIT: But staying on this topic of drivers test and I don’t know if you had to do parallel parking on your test. But a lot of states are starting to get rid of this as a requirement on the test.
KATE: What? That is a total mistake. Why uh like how did they defend that?
TARANJIT: I don’t know. I know here in Maryland, they just removed it and I don’t know why. But like now the test is so easy. Do you think this should be something that should be included on a drivers test?
KATE: Yeah. I mean there has to be something that determines the cutoff between a person who can drive safely in a person who can’t drive safely. Because not everyone can. And so you have to sort of there has to be something on the test where people prove that they are safe drivers.
BHAVNEET: Right. And I think it’s like there’s so many places that t’is just an important skill that you need to have. It’s like how else would you park your car?
KATE: know. It’s so ridiculous that we’re even talking about this. I mean, it’s like I mean, it’s essential to be able to park parallel park your car. Now, I have to stay when I did my drivers test there. I did have to parallel park and I am embarrassed to say this because I just gave you this glowing report of my class and my teacher, and it was perfect. And I was so prepared. But I do remember that in my test I really wanted to get I really wanted to like be very precise with my parking, and I didn’t want to do like an Annie Hall where I was, you know, half a meter from the curb. So I was very very close to the car that I was the car that I was sort of hugging and then pulling back into the space behind it. I wanted to be close to that car so that I would end up being close to the curb. But I do remember that that at the very like he let me go as long as he cut in then at the very last minute my teacher I remember it as my teacher but this may have actually been that the examiner. It may have been my actual drivers test. He like suddenly reached over like a reflex and and turned the steering wheel so that I wouldn’t take the paint off that other car. So that wasn’t good.
BHAVNEET: So you had to take your test with an actual car there?
KATE: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we were driving like on the road. Like we were it wasn’t a closed-circuit kind of thing. Was yours?
TARANJIT: Yeah, we have for parallel parking, they set cones up and you just do it in between the cones.
KATE: Oh. How funny. I don’t remember. I mean I might be wrong. As I said, it has been a long time. But I remember I mean our drivers ed classes were definitely just out and about around town. And I remember my test being that way to.
TARANJIT: Maybe they just had too many car accidents in a way that they’re just like, let’s do cones. If they hit the cone it’s okay.
KATE: Exactly Maybe maybe they maybe they switched to cones after me. They are like, whoa. We cannot take that chance again.
TARANJIT: You’re the one that started the cones.
KATE: It’s my fault. I apologize.
BHAVNEET: We have a final bonus question that we like to ask everyone.
KATE: Oh.
BHAVNEET: If you could make one new driving law, what would it be?
KATE: Well, this is not going to win me any points with my nieces and nephews who are all in the United States. But the minimum age for getting your drivers license in Spain is 18 and I do think that that is a more realistic age than 16. I never would have said that at 16, but just judging from what I see here and even from young drivers, you know, even for 18-year-olds who just got their license who just seem like they’re even at 18 they’re too young. I do think that that just sounds awful. I don’t want to be that person. But I guess that’s my answer. That that it wouldn’t be awful if the minimum age for getting your driver’s license was older than 16.
TARANJIT: I can see where you are coming from, now that I am older and have driven for a while. But like I guess what people in that younger age, they’re like, but I want it now.
KATE: Yeah. Yeah, I mean that’s just I think it’s like that with a lot of things. Like not so much with the vote because you know voting like you’re not going to hurt anyone really. Like you’re just going and casting a vote. But like serving in the military or I mean, you’re an adult at 18 right Like you you are responsible for yourself at 18 and yet why is that the cut-off. It just seems so young.
TARANJIT: Yeah.
KATE: But I think that’s just that’s just a result of having quite a bit of it more experience and being quite a bit older than that now.
TARANJIT: Do you have any final thoughts or any tips that you would like to give other drivers?
KATE: Well, I will say that this has been an absolute joy talking with the two of you meeting you and I kind of wish we should we could turn the tables and and I could ask you about about your drivers driving experiences. But I think what I’ll do instead is dig into your archives and listen to some of your other interviews because this really has been fascinating. I really appreciate you inviting me on and and encouraging me to kind of look through my memories and find these old stories. it’s been really really interesting and really fun to kind of revisit them.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. we really enjoyed having you on. I mean our stories go on forever and ever. But we really enjoyed listening to your experiences, especially since you’ve lived in Spain and in the US before. And where can listeners find you if they want to listen to your show or connect with you?
KATE: Yeah so well you mentioned my show. I’m the host of The Listen Podcast. That’s probably the best way not only to get in touch with me, but I really encourage people to dip into the show. We got a great, we got eight full seasons now at this point that people can explore. So our website is thelistenpodcast.com. The show features long-form interviews and highlights, what we try to focus on is the common threads that run through different cultures. Each season is focused on a different topic and you can find us wherever you get your podcast.
BHAVNEET: Thank you so much for coming on today. We had a blast talking to you.
KATE: It was great. Thanks you guys.
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BHAVNEET: How do you feel about Kate’s new law or how would you have felt about it If that actually was a law when you were say 16? That you can’t get your license until what was it like later when you’re 18?
TARANJIT: Yeah. I feel like in the moment I would well actually if I knew I was going to fail a number of times I failed, I would be like I would want to start at 16 so I would get it by the time. If I started at 18 then I would wait I wouldn’t have been able to go to College.
BHAVNEET: Yeah.
TARANJIT: Because I wouldn’t have been able to drive. So in a way of getting in a 16 gives you those two years or so to be prepared for when you are truly on your own. Instead of like at 18 you got it and then it’s like okay. Bye. You didn’t have that time to practice because that transition from high-school to college is already so stressful cuz you’re trying to do all these other things and then on top of that learning to like become a better driver in the process, it would be more hard.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. I also it just I agree in the sense that I see all these crazy youngsters like we’re so old.
TARANJIT: I know. We’re so old.
BHAVNEET: These crazy youngsters driving. It’s like, aw. You should not be having your license. When I was that age, I would have wanted my license. Not that we drove at that age. But I had my license.
TARANJIT: Well actually, It was more like you got your license, and now just sit there.
BHAVNEET: So I mean, technically it was like you were 18 that we started driving, but we had our license
TARANJIT: Exactly.
BHAVNEET: So we didn’t have to worry about that.
TARANJIT: I didn’t even get my first car until the day before college starts. Okay. Now you really need a car. So here’s a car.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. Yeah that that was.
TARANJIT: But if you ask a lot of people who are currently in the driving age, they will be like, no. But then now this lockdown pandemic who knows how long this is going to go on for has probably put a dent. Is that the word? In people’s plans.
BHAVNEET: A dent?
TARANJIT: Like what’s the word?
BHAVNEET: A wrench? Throwing a wrench in it. Ha. Putting a dent in it.
TARANJIT: Car terms.
BHAVNEET: Like my plan is not straight now, it is now bent.
TARANJIT: Exactly. They can’t just go straight to the DMV, they have to work around it
BHAVNEET: But then how do people come up with throw a wrench in their plans? Like a wrench and then it bends your plans also?
TARANJIT: I don’t know.
BHAVNEET: And speaking of crazy drivers, her biggest pet peeve of young men drivers in Spain
TARANJIT: Oh my gosh. I thought we had a bad, but then when she started describing that, I’m like, oh. We have it no where close.
BHAVNEET: I well we also don’t have circles in a scale that Europe has circles.
TARANJIT: But the ones in the cities are huge. When she was talking about it, I kind of pictured the one in D.C. cuz that one was crazy.
BHAVNEET: But that wasn’t even as big. Like if you imagine like the one in London.
TARANJIT: Oh, I know.
BHAVNEET: That’s like its own city in and of itself.
TARANJIT: Exactly. I dont I don’t even.
BHAVNEET: How do you even like anyone in the inner lane, how do you get into the inner lane? And also how do you get back out?
TARANJIT: It going to be you just have to each circle is one more lane out. It’s like 8 circles before you get out.
BHAVNEET: Exactly. Yeah. That’s what I don’t understand. Who would even go to the very inner lane because you have to go all the way back out?
TARANJIT: There has to be multiple lanes to exit. It can’t just be the outside most lane that exits, right?
BHAVNEET: I don’t know. But in comparison they have circles we have round pounds.
TARANJIT: Round pounds. No. They call them roundabouts. We call them circles for some reason. Because everyone else we’ve talked to say roundabouts.
BHAVNEET: Oh, that’s true. Okay, we’re like geometric shape. Circle.And they’re over there like you go around it. Sophisticated. And we’re just like circle. Square. Round pound. ,
TARANJIT: Well that’s our dad misunderstanding the GPS saying roundabout
BHAVNEET: Yeah. But still, we’re just like circle.
TARANJIT: No but like I think the thing that we see when drivers with drivers in the circles roundabouts is that they can’t stay in their lane. They tend to go back and forth between inner and outer and just like in a sense cut straight through in a way
BHAVNEET: I mean, yeah. Just the other day, we saw like a person that’s in the right lane and then they go into the left lane right before you enter the circle. And then as you get in the circle they go back to the right lane and then when they’re exiting the circle they get back into the left lane. And then were like, huh?
TARANJIT: Exactly. So imagine that happening on an eight-lane circle. Roundabout. Now I’m going to feel weird when I say circle. On an 8 lane roundabout. Imagine that. Like I couldn’t do it. I can see why she had the anxiety and stuff from that.
BHAVNEET: Yeah. Our tangents aside, we hoped you enjoy listening to Kate’s crazy driving stories about the differences of driving in Spain vs America, and if you or anyone, you know has any interesting driving stories and would love to be a guest, you can fill out the interest form on our website at drivewithuspodcast.com.
TARANJIT: And stay tuned until the end for a sneak peek of next week’s episode where we are joined by Ashley who is another world traveler we talked to and she shared her stories of driving in Vietnam and Bali and how she had a Google Maps disaster. Thanks for driving with us.
(outro music)
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(next week’s sneak peek)
ASHLEY: It was like my first month driving a motorbike at that point. And so I was driving on this massive bridge and then all of a sudden my motorbike just stopped working. This is my first month in Vietnam and this happens and I just thought you know, what is my life?